Andrews Farm Dog Training

Andrews Farm Dog Training Dog Training by Fran Andrews
Herding, Obedience,
Behavior Modification Training is Fun! Lessons are available by appointment only.

Andrews Farm offers training for all breeds of dogs - obedience, herding and behavior modification. It should be enjoyable time spent with your dog, where you both learn skills and about each other.

Stop at the top?https://www.facebook.com/share/18mWBtkZCJ/
06/22/2026

Stop at the top?

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Alasdair rarely posts on Facebook but he and I were caught in a downpour this morning and while sheltering from the storm, we got on the topic of stopping dogs at the top of the outrun.
We’ve heard there’s a small group of judges penalizing dogs at trials that stop at the top.
It’s something Alasdair and I do often and we believe it’s vital, never mind shouldn’t be penalized.
I asked him to write, as a shepherd, his thoughts——

When gathering on the highland hills with steep rock faces, deep sided Burns (creeks) with waterfalls and few crossing places, you needed either a lot of people walking in a staggered line or fewer people if they had good dogs.
The rule at these gatherings was that the less control you had on your dog, the less distance you were allowed to send them; some were never off the leash until the sheep were all bunched.
They would put me in the difficult places because I could stop my dogs at a distance and keep them stopped, while the sheep negotiated the narrow sheep paths (trods) where it was too dangerous for people to walk on and sometimes even for sheep, but a dog could follow carefully or be stopped strategically, to give the sheep plenty time to find their own way.
If hurried, a lead sheep could slip and fall, the rest might, thinking it was safe, follow the lead sheep down a precipice and that was disaster.

When doing pre lambing gathering in the highlands, I used to send my dogs out a lot further than most, to where the sheep could see the dog, and then I’d lie my dog down at the end of its outrun as some twin bearing ewes were weaker and couldn’t stand being pressured by a dog, no matter how gently approached.
If a shepherd could stop their dog and give the sheep plenty of time, the ewes would follow and try and keep with the others, safely navigating their way.
Too much dog or a dog getting too close, and you would have the healthy sheep run and when the weaker ewes couldn’t keep up with them, they would turn and face the dog, lie down or otherwise be unable to make it all the way to the sheep fank (working pens), which would then require shepherds to come back out again another day or maybe two days, to find those weaker ewes and try to bring them home. That could take days and was very costly in man hours when there was a lot of work on; time and daylight were precious commodities.
The importance of a stop at the end of an outrun was magnified in these situations.
If you couldn’t stop your dog, the farmers often said not to send your dog but walk up and down the hill, shout and whistle and try to help move them along the face of the hill yourself.
The farther away you could stop your dog, the more effective and efficient you could be.
A stop on the hill was worth its weight in gold in many situations.

It’s always been difficult to get a dog that could push heavy groups of sheep to be obedient at half a mile and also work out of sight by itself if required; all three things are necessary and all three important and to be encouraged, not penalized but to be bred for and displayed for future breeders at trials.

Stronger dogs, the ones that are especially effective on bigger and heavier groups, should often be stopped to make them more subtle lifting and prove to breeders they can be obedient at a distance.
The versatility of the working border collie is one of their most revered traits, their ability to work on their own and also to instantly take commands at a distance both important.

Hearing that there are a small group of politicians/judges penalizing a handler that stops their dog at trials at the end of an outrun, goes against a sought after and important quality, one that generations of hill shepherds and breeders of olde have strived for and greatly valued.
I for one, am not arrogant enough to think that I know better.

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06/19/2026

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Moving Sheep on the Farm and Trial Field
Kathy Knox
Issue 53 – 1997

When I am on a trial field I always try to think to myself, “If these were my sheep, would I like them handled in this way?” Several years ago, at a trial in Wisconsin, the owner of the sheep came to me and said, “I watched your run and that was just the way I like to see my sheep handled.” That really meant a lot to me. It wasn’t about how I scored on the run. It was just about how we handled the sheep. We put them around the course but we did not run them everywhere, they just went at a nice pace and respected the dog.

Many handlers try to force the sheep around the course; they don’t consider what the sheep are thinking. A lot of people don’t think sheep can think, but they can. All you have to do is set and watch for a while and you can see them thinking. They know when a dog is in the right place and when it’s not, especially the wilder sheep out west. When I helped lamb a flock in Montana, my dog could be out of place by just a few inches and these sheep would be gone. They would just take off and leave. The dog and I would look at each other and think, “What happened?” It was amazing to watch those sheep. They would see the smallest of holes and I could see them thinking, trying to decide if they could out maneuver the dog and get away.

One day, while lambing at home, I didn’t have a dog with me and I was carrying a set of twins out of the lambing field. Because I had my hands full, I had left the gate open just a little. There was a ewe that hadn’t lambed yet standing with the rest of the sheep. I saw that ewe pick up her head and look out through that gate. I could tell she had decided she was going out through that gate, and I was too far away to stop her, so I just yelled, “Hey.” She threw her head up, stopped, and looked over her shoulder. Then she started forward again so I yelled again. This time she turned and went back to the flock. To me, the reason it stopped her was that it made her nervous, she wasn’t sure she wanted to go out. Then, when I yelled the second time she decided she didn’t want to go out. I was quite a way away and couldn’t put any body pressure on her, but it was enough to change her mind.

It reminds me of the times when I have been trying to load sheep in a trailer with other people helping. Just as they start to go in, someone will run up behind them yelling. Instead of running on into the trailer they all turn and run out.

When a dog approaches the sheep and makes its first contact, like on the lift, I like for them to approach with a quiet, steady, but confident manner. I want the dog to look right into the sheep’s eyes and in this way tell the sheep, “I want you to move.” In the ideal situation I would rather the dog did not stop as it makes contact and walks toward the sheep. If the sheep are light and running it is a different situation, but ideally, I want the dog to come on with quiet authority. Then I watch the sheep to see their body language starting to bend, or move off from the dog. As they slowly start to melt away from the dog, I like the dog to slow or pause slightly to allow the sheep time to start moving. I want the dog to feel and react to the sheep. As the sheep start walking the dog should then walk along at a nice, steady pace.

If the dog does not properly feel and react to the pressure of the sheep, one of two things can happen. Either the sheep will freeze back to the dog, almost afraid to move, or they will come too fast. To me, the initial contact with the sheep is the most important part of working them properly.

I help to teach the dog to feel the pressure of the sheep and to react properly to it when working up close. As I see the dog has made contact and the sheep are about to start moving, I will talk to the dog saying, “There now.” I get the dog to pause enough to allow the sheep time to turn before it continues walking up.

If the dog walks up properly but the sheep will not move off of him, I may stop the dog completely; get him to take all the pressure off. Often, when we give the sheep a few seconds, they will turn and go. I will let them take hold of the sheep if all else fails, but again the second the sheep start to turn and move I want the dog to let go, and again allow the sheep to turn and move. Some people encourage their dogs to continue to grip after the sheep start to move, but that is just abuse and to me that is pointless. The sheep don’t need that, they need to be taught a lesson of respect, but they shouldn’t be in fear of their life.

We want to teach the sheep that when they give and start to move the dog will give and allow them to move off. The give and take of pressure is extremely critical when moving ewes with lambs. Anytime the dog gets into the sheep’s face too much she will turn and fight, then we can’t get anything done. The dog has to stay far enough off so the ewe doesn’t feel her lambs will be eaten. The ewe is just trying to defend her lamb. If I have a dog that is constantly in the sheep’s face, causing her to turn and fight, I will get in and correct the dog. I don’t blame it on the sheep. It’s not the sheep’s fault. The dog and I have made this happen.

Once the sheep start moving, I will try to keep the flow going. To do that we need to let the sheep think they are doing what they want. Too much pressure or tight flanks will cause a fight situation again.

If the sheep are weak or sick, I will keep the dog way back and put on a much gentler pressure. I will also walk out and help push the sheep. To allow the dog to bite a weak or sick sheep is just abuse.

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Tollie Weldon Road
Henderson, NC
27537

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